mimiDV to DVD - deintelace?

[Damian]

I have content that I want to get from mimiDV (cannon XL1) to DVD. I have all the tools to encode the miniDV to DVD mpeg2 format.

However, my question is do I deinterlace the miniDV before the encoding it for the DVD?

I have encoded interlaced tests and the motion looks VERY bad when played back on the dvd player.

Does anyone know the 'rule' about this?

[Vey]

I have had some luck, finally!

After much testing, and a bit of luck (thanks to a few suggestions), I have had some success with deinterlacing video before going to DVD.

Here is a quick walkthrough. If you would like details on any of it just ask.

1. Export .vob file from DVD with Smartripper
2. Convert .vob file to uncompressed AVI with FlaskMPG
a. You can deinterlace at this step. If you do, use settings between 10 and 20. The lower the setting, the better it removes the deinterlacing effect, but it causes ghosting. I found 14 or 15 worked pretty well. HOWEVER, I don’t deinterlace at this step. There is a better way.
3. Edit video in whatever program you like. If you use Premier you can use a videoserver program to export the edited video right to step 4. Otherwise, you will need to save the video back to uncompressed AVI (to avoid quality loss)
4. Encode video in TMPGEnc. The following page will be useful: http://pwp.netcabo.pt/0165394101/TMPGEnc_Template.html
a. On the MPEG setting page, Advanced tab double click Deinterlace (None) option. This will bring up the options to select type of deinterlacer and you can view your video file and compare options. I found Double worked best. Just make sure when you are done that the deinterlace box is checked.
b. On the MPEG settings page, Video tab, Chose Non-interlaced (may also be called progressive) for encode mode
5. Author with DVD software. I am using DVDit PE, but there are probably better programs out there.

Notes: The first time I tried this I think I did exactly what you did. I left the video interlaced all the way through, and when I played it on a TV it looked terrible. I am only guessing, but I think it had to do with either the Field order (I will get to that in a sec) or the fact that the encoding program reinterlaced an already interlaced source. By deinterlacing the video then choosing non-interlaced as the final product this should be eliminated. However, some players can’t deal with non-interlaced video. Some Toshibas seem to have a problem with it.

Field order: The link above talks about it a bit, and I don’t have much to add, but the problem you described and what I saw on my first test are similar to the description of improper field order selection. Unfortunately you can’t really tell if this is a problem until you try the video on a TV. Fortunately there are only two options. In my case TOP has worked, but then by deinterlacing the video it may negate this issue.

I hope this helps. I would be happy to go into more detail. I am still playing with it, but have been successful so far with a test DVD that played fine on over half the players I tested it on. This included Pioneer (which seem to be the most compatible), Kenwood, and many PC players. I have tested it on standard TVs, HDTVs with non-progressive DVD players, and HDTVs with progressive players (which look great).

-Vey

[Damian]

ok, makes sence

thanks for the insight vey,

ill test some clips with the setting you mention...the part i dont have to do is the dvd ripping, the raw footage is in miniDV format (interlaced) so my process starts from there, then i load the edited miniDV avi file intoi into TMPGEnc and encode for DVD output.

by the way... in my version of TMPGEnc, their is no 'Double' setting for de-interlace. There is a 'blend' setting? is that the same?


Also, according to the directions on the link you gave me (very good info there) it sais to let the mpeg setting stay 'interlaced' when encoding the mpeg2 file for DVD (but the source should be de-interlaced) .... and u mentioned set that to de-interlaced (progressive)... im unclear on this setting....



I'll try your settings and report what happenes.....
Thanks again....

[omarh]

Hey guys, it doesn't make any sense to deInterlace
when mpeg-2 fully supports interlaced video.
Whenever you deinterlace, unless you use a detelecine 3:2 pulldown filter, you lose quality!! the typical deinterlace filters blend and interpolate which makes the image a bit fuzzy.

I just go straight from miniDV AVI files to mpeg2 using the LSX plugin for adobe premiere 6.

I wonder if maybe you're picking the wrong field order...that would make your resulting mpeg2 file look really messed up during motion...

In the LSX plugin, i have to select if its botton field first....
you can find out which one it is by looking at the properties of the AVI file.

or just trying one or the other to see which one looks right.

[Damian]

i agree...but

i agree omar, deinterlacing is a step to avoid....however, it seems TMPGEnc encodes the mpeg2 file intelaced, even if the incoming data is already interlaced, so you get double interlaced and it ends up to be horrible motion, looking obviously wrong....I have tried many different setting and it always encodes it this way, the only way around it is to deinterlace the incoming video first...

however, I will try the LSX encoder and do some tests and get back to you with results......

thanks for the input....

[omarh]

In TMPEG, isn't there a place where you can select the type of input you have? Does it know that the input is Interlaced???

Anyway, just use LSX encoder...it works fine.

also DVD wants interlaced video anyway since its designed to be displayed on a TV set which needs interlaced video

[Damian]

not good

well, i must be doing somthing else wrong, i tried the lsx encoder set to the default dvd setting and once again i got what appeared to be interlaceing of already interlaced frames...looked really bad

I must be missing somthing obvious, if i play the same miniDV file out to my cannonXL1 to the tv, it looks perfect, I mean flawless and perfect smooth motion....same when i do a preview in adobe preimere out to the tv (via cannonxl1), perfect motion

as soon as i mpeg2 encode it, it gets screwed up and double interlaced (or whatever is going on) and playes bad on the dvd/tv

...i have the lower feild set right i think, so i must be missing somthing else?


PS. yes, u are right omar, tmpenc does have a setting for the input that I left 'interlaced' and i still got bad results

also, when i view the properties of an avi file i dont get the info on if its interlaced or the feild order,...where do you see that?

[Damian]

test worked with lsx

ok, I did a small test using the lsx encoder and it worked when i played it back on the dvd player, the motion was perfect

so I am concluding that the version of the TMPENc encoder I have is not 'marking'the outpur mpeg2 file correctly so it does not play back interlaced

a few notes:

1) I used the lsx preire plugin.

2) I loaded the default lsx DVD assets setting, and as you mentioned Omar...then I MADE SURE to chage the feild setting in preimere's output settings to 'lower field first' ....loding the lsx DVD setting will set it to 'no fields'

I just encoded 40 minests of miniDV video and will burn it to a dvd and tet it tonight...I'll post the results.

side notes:
I actually think TMPEnc is a slightly better encoder but it is evident that the quality is better when you leave it interlaced as intended (as the lsx output showed me) and not deintelace it, then encode it, where it getsw re-interlaced for playback


...more to come...