Is it safe to delete PGC's and VTS's?

[spyhawk]

It's a matter of personal preference really. I use the macro when I don't have time and I need the dvd fast. Given the time, I always do my own rerouting faster than the macro can on simple structure dvd, and am familiar with the style of navigation of the DVD by just looking at it without really tracing it. On some DVDs, the navigation just looks so unnecessarily complicated b/c of the authoring software that I just rewrite all of them to make it simple, and also a chance for me to delete lots of junk.

[idontno]

@Calimari,

[Calimari]

I use the macro when I don't have time and I need the dvd fast. Given the time, I always do my own rerouting faster than the macro can on simple structure dvd

So when you don't have time and you need the disc quickly, you use the macro. But when you do have time, you do the rerouting yourself... faster than the macro?

I always do my own rerouting faster than the macro can on simple structure dvd

Really? Searching for unused GPRM's, checking to see if there aren't any commands jumping to First Play PGC, searching your desired starting point and placing a Toggle PGC playback breakpoint there, starting a trace to that point, copying Change Registers as commands, importing them in the First Play PGC's pre-command window, etc. etc.
So you can do all this faster than the macro? Man, I wanna see that. Do you give seminars?

and am familiar with the style of navigation of the DVD by just looking at it without really tracing it.

Cool, now we can skip trace mode. Lol, you're jokin', right?

On some DVDs, the navigation just looks so unnecessarily complicated b/c of the authoring software that I just rewrite all of them to make it simple, and also a chance for me to delete lots of junk.

Damn, I've never thought that way. You're right. You don't need all those commands. They're just there to fill up space. Those companies don't know what they're doiing. You do.
How does your self-written navigations look like? Jump to title 1 and set audiostream = 0? Something like that?

[idontno]

Ok. I Deleted a bunch of VTS in DVDRMP and cleaned up the mess it made of the VMG's.

Now I opened in PgcEdit and found a lot of "never called" VMG's, but they won't delete.



Guess I could go back to DVDRMP and do it.

But I thought PgcEdit was suppossed to do all this, so I don't have to keep jumping back and forth between progs.

I'd like to keep PgcEdit as my Main Editor. It does almost everything except wipe my butt.

.

[blutach]

I too find it hard to believe it could be faster than the macro. It's over in the blink of an eye

@idontno - just delete the uncalled PGCs via the new function. But do test your DVD - very carefully.

Regards

[Calimari]

I'd like to keep PgcEdit as my Main Editor. It does almost everything except wipe my butt.
.

Good idea. Why use DVD Remake when we have such a powerfull editor as PgcEdit for free. Also, why use them together?
I suggest you start all over and follow blutah's guide, earlier in this thread.

[idontno]

I suggest you start all over and follow blutah's guide, earlier in this thread.

I agree.

EDIT: No wonder I couldn't delete them. I was using the old PgcEdit. I did a system restore a couple days ago and it must have replaced my shortcuts.


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[r0lZ]

Funny discussion!

Of course, the macro is faster than doing the same job manually. But I agree that redoing the whole authoring is sometimes a better solution, especially on very complex DVDs if you want to remove many things. When I extract only the main film and the basic menus (main, audio, subpic and chapter menus), I like to redo everything, keeping only the necessary PGCs. I can have exactly the navigation I want. But, of course, that's time consuming.

And, yes, sometimes I really think that some original commands are just useless. Most authoring programs have a specific method to access the titles and menu PGCs, and it might be very complicated, as it is required that the authoring can handle every situation. Obviously, for an human, it might be simpler to do it differently.

[blutach]

One thing I like to do (if I have the time) is change the Preferred languages to 'en and remove lotsa rubbishy lines (not that it is anything but cosmetic).

Regards

[Calimari]

One thing I like to do (if I have the time) is change the Preferred languages to 'en
Regards

Exactly, I do that with preferred audio, subtitle and menu language.
I don't want my backup to be dependent on the player's settings.

[spyhawk]

Really? Searching for unused GPRM's, checking to see if there aren't any commands jumping to First Play PGC, searching your desired starting point and placing a Toggle PGC playback breakpoint there, starting a trace to that point, copying Change Registers as commands, importing them in the First Play PGC's pre-command window, etc. etc.
So you can do all this faster than the macro? Man, I wanna see that. Do you give seminars?

I know you won't believe me. That's ok. I've done enough to be kinda familiar with some common style of dvd navigation, even some GPRMs where it does all those unnecessary bitwise-AND/OR operation. For example, on a complicated DVD, where you go through all those warnings, trailers, etc., and the redundant jumping here-and-there before going to the main menu. Instead of going through the trace mode, applying the breakpoint on the intended PGC, using the macro, and then restarting the trace to verify that it works, you just need to know which GPRMs is important, change the values accordingly and redirect the jump at appropriate place, usually in the VMG. And no, I don't put all these changes at First Play. Sorry, there's no sure way to tell you how. This only comes with practice and experience.

As for simple structure DVD, it's a piece of cake - no need for macro. This is by no means that the macro is useless, it is very reliable and I do use it sometimes.

It's the cleanup and menu editing that takes a bit of time. But I'm glad that there's a Find and Delete Uncalled PGCs, which proves to be very useful.

Why use DVD Remake when we have such a powerfull editor as PgcEdit for free.

DvdReMake Pro combines the major functionalities of PgcEdit and VobBlanker or FixVTS and looks more user friendly at least to me. With the many functions in PgcEdit, I'm not sure which function PgcEdit actually delete without the need to go through VobBlanker or FixVTS. Perhaps someone can point out which one. Sorry, I have not the time to try it all.

[r0lZ]

PgcEdit is not a VOB editor. Therefore, it does only a few things on the VOBs.

It is easy and really fast (at least a lot faster than DRM) to blank out completely a domain, as PgcEdit needs only to move the original VOBs to the backup folder, and replace them by a tiny cell.
In the other hand, if you want to blank only some PGCs in a domain, or some cells in a PGC, PgcEdit appends the tiny cell at the end of the VOB file, and reuses that cell if the user wants to blank out more PGCs or cells in the same domain. The original cells are not automatically removed from the VOB files in this case. Therefore, you have to run FixVTS or VobBlanker to remove them.
PgcEdit can also edit the menu buttons and the BOVs.

It is true that DRM can do that (and probably more) without the need of external programs, but the price to pay is that the VOB files have to be rewritten if you change something. With PgcEdit, if you don't need to regain the disc space used by the blanked cells, you don't need to rewrite the VOBs.

[Calimari]

DvdReMake Pro combines the major functionalities of PgcEdit and VobBlanker or FixVTS and looks more user friendly at least to me. With the many functions in PgcEdit, I'm not sure which function PgcEdit actually delete without the need to go through VobBlanker or FixVTS. Perhaps someone can point out which one. Sorry, I have not the time to try it all.

It looks more user friendly, but that's a cosmetic thing. Good software doesn't need fancy colors and flashy buttons. Though I admit DVDRM gives a clear overview of the content of the disc. But it's a heavy application (my office pc P4 2800MHz 512MB RAM chokes on it), it produced a few non-compliant outputs last time I used it, and ... it's not free. Also, the latest version is now 6 months old. The guys who wrote FixVTS, PgcEdit and VobBlanker, float around in these forums and are an open ear to suggestions and bug reports. Their goal is: getting their software better and better, not earning more money. Remember, the best software written, was the free software (DVD Decrypter, DVD Shrink, IfoEdit, ImgBurn, PgcEdit, VobBlanker, ImgBurn, etc.). Once the author gets hired by a software company, you'll probably never hear from them again (Shrink, IfoEdit, ...). Yes, there are exceptions, I know.
I don't say DVDRM is a bad program, but I like more the combination of those free programs. Each author improves his own software, and I don't see the problem with using them together. They work perfectly together (eg plugins).

I'm not sure which function PgcEdit actually delete without the need to go through VobBlanker or FixVTS

PgcEdit is an IFO editor, it does a few things more than deleting stuff, you know. But it can also blank and kill playback (skip) parts of the DVD, that's when running VobBlanker or fixVTS is recommended to gain space, but strictly it's not necessary to run one of them.

[blutach]

I like them both and use them both!

When rewriting VOB files in DVD Remake Pro, you have the option of rewriting only modified files, which can save some time.

In my view, each has its advantages over the other in certain areas.

Quite frankly, I count myself extremely lucky to have these 2 powerful tools at my disposal, along with jsoto's and jeanl's wonderful proggys. Couple in the mighty DVD Rebuilder and I'm in DVD heaven

Regards

[Calimari]

blutah, I'm a fan of DVD-RB too.
Do you know if it can be launched from within PgcEdit's Tools section?
I mean with the right settings, extracted from PgcEdit's arguments (title, path,...) and a few manual settings (one click-mode, encoding passes, etc...). It would make things easy to save a DVD-RB project, or immediatly do the rebuilding and then reload the Disc in PgcEdit again.
Building a string is very easy with PgcEdit's arguments, but I don't know if DVD-RB supports CLI.
As an alternative, an RBD project is nothing more than a text file, it should be possible to create one in PgcEdit without opening DVD-RB itself. You know any script editor/creator that can do this? (launch the app in PgcEdit with the right arguments and create an RBD file)
I've read that jdobbs has quit the 32K gap method because Anydvd has problems with it (I still don't understand why you need Anydvd after a rebuild). Anyway, that's why I like to reload a rebuilt disc in PgcEdit again, to do a last compliancy check and then create the ISO or burn it.