Converting WS to Standard screen?

[ed klein]

Typical Example:

You have a 27 inch full screen TV
Your source movie is widescreen 16:9

What most people don't like or don't want:

The TV PICTURE FRAME has approximately 1 to 2 inches of black border on the top and bottom of the screen.

How to get rid of the top and bottom black borders and still maintain the source 16:9 aspect ratio so the people won't be streatched.

Use TMPGEnc Plus and use frame clip on the top and bottom of the screen.
Also use the option, NO MARGIN KEEP ASPECT RATIO

End Results---------
The picture fills up the entire screen to the ends of the TV PICTURE FRAME and no black borders anywhere.

[mc4man]

We're till stuck in 4:3 land in my house with a 27" and 32" tv's and everybody hates fullscreen. It seems more natural to watch in 16:9, maybe because we have 2 eyes on the sides of our faces instead of 1 in the middle, I don't know.
Though in the case of 2.35+:1 movies i can certainly see how underwhelming
they can be on a 4:3 tv. In SOME cases you can certainly lose a little picture from the sides for a better viewing exp. As a compromise I use
Lanczos4Resize(720,480,87,58,546,364)
which brings the size up near 1.85:1 without any distortion that I can see,
though maybe there's better values to use

[katzdvd]

How to get rid of the top and bottom black borders and still maintain the source 16:9 aspect ratio so the people won't be streatched.

Use TMPGEnc Plus and use frame clip on the top and bottom of the screen.
Also use the option, NO MARGIN KEEP ASPECT RATIO

End Results---------
The picture fills up the entire screen to the ends of the TV PICTURE FRAME and no black borders anywhere.

Ed, I will ask this question again, as I did earlier in the thread; Using your method, which is different than prev. discussed, will the end result be a "stretched" unnatural looking picture? i.e., 7' tall people?

[r0lZ]

I may be wrong, but I don't believe I have viewed any WS movie on a friends' WS TV that didn't have the black horizontal bars at the top/bottom.

Either you are wrong , or you have just watched only CinemaScope movies till now.
Anyway, currently, more than 80% of the movies are in standard 16:9 format, with no black borders when viewed on a 16:9 TV, but obviously with big black borders on a 4:3 TV.
Note that there is a little difference between the US widescreen format, and the European one. None are exactly in 16:9. But the difference is so small that 16:9 is a good in-between compromise. Anyway, the black borders added in one of those formats (I don't remember which) are so small that they are normally completely covered by the border of the TV set.
On the other hand, 4:3 is not adapted to the movie formats at all, unless you watch only movies from the Charlie Chaplin age, or TV series (but, as I said, even most of the new European TV series are no longer in 4:3 format.)

Anyway, you are free to watch the final duel in a good old Sergio Leone film in pan&scan, and see only the dust between the protagonists, if you prefer that.

[photo_angel2004]

No, of course! It is not possible to conserve the right aspect ratio when you change only the aspect ratio in the IFOs.
To force FS while keeping the correct aspect ratio, you have to leave the 16:9 param in the IFOs as it is, but clear the "automatic letterbox" flag and set the "automatic pan&scan" mode.
This way, your movie will be shown in full screen, but, of course, you will loose an important part of the image.
Take care also at the subpics. They might be too large to be shown entirely on your TV.

IMO, the best thing to do is to leave the original aspect ratio unchanged. You will probably buy a 16:9 TV soon anyway, as the production of 4:3 TVs will probably cease soon (except the very cheap or portable models.)
Here in Europe, and especially in Germany and Belgium, even the TV shows are now broadcasted in 16:9 format.

I was just trying to get a few of my sons favorite movies on FUll, since he has a small tv in his room not like the 60" in the living room.

I am sure one day everything probably will be in WS, how ever we live in WI state (USA) and we are about 10 year behind Europe.


Thanks for your help r0lZ I will give that panscan box a tick and see if that makes it work. Not looking for perfection just trying to get my son off my back on this issue. On a 20" tv the ws pic isnt all that big.

When it come to the Disney movies I try to get both WS and Standard, standard for now. When my big screen goes out I am sure that I will have to go to WS by then that is probably all that will be out.



EDIT:


I have tryed again ticking the panscan box and leaving it on 16:9, I still have WS now the black bars on top and bottom are larger then before. This just wont go to FS. Is there any other setting I need to change?

I dont understand why this is not working at all.

[ed klein]

@KATZDVD,

"QUOTE"

Ed, I will ask this question again, as I did earlier in the thread; Using your method, which is different than prev. discussed, will the end result be a "stretched" unnatural looking picture?

It has not been stretched for me. Using TMPGEnc Plus to do the frame clip on the top and bottom black borders, and then the option NO MARGINS KEEP ASPECT RATIO has worked for me.

If your TV is full screen 4:3
And your source movie is widescreen 16:9

What you are doing is KEEPING the aspect ratio of 16:9 but modifying it to look like a fake full screen 4:3 overlay. And thus no stretched people, no top and bottom black borders, but not as wide as widescreen.



If you use this method and your are done encoding and authoring the disk, BEFORE you try out the movie on your DVD player, make sure the options (aspect ratio) set on your DVD player is set to 16:9 widescreen.

[r0lZ]

That exactly what I would have replied, ed klein.

With my method, the real AR is still 16:9, but a part of the image is outside the visible part of a 4:3 display.

In theory, when a 16:9 movie is displayed on a 4:3 TV, the DVD player is responsible to add the black borders in letterbox mode, or to cut the left and right borders in pan&scan mode. The 4:3 TV cannot do that, as many 4:3 TV were produced before the introduction of the 16:9 format.
Of course, you must configure the player so that it knows that your TV is a 4:3 TV. (This is normally the default setting.) Furthermore, you have a preferred aspect ratio setting in the player. When both the letterbox and pan&scan flags are ticked in Domain Streams Attributes, the player should use the preferred mode configured by the user. So, theoretically, you can watch the same movie in letterbox or in pan&scan on the same hardware. All you have to do is to modify the settings of the player, and use a DVD with the two flags ticked.
Unfortunately, some players are not good enough to deal with that settings correctly. This is especially true for cheap players, and for most standalone DVD recorders. In some rare cases, the player has no setting at all, and will always assume the movie is in 4:3 format! Of course, those players are totally out of specs, and should be avoided.

So, photo_angel, to summarize, you should verify the settings of the player of your kids: it must be configured for a 4:3 TV, and your preferred AR should be pan&scan.
You must also at least tick the automatic p&s flag in Domain Streams Attributes, but theoretically, ticking also the letterbox scan doesn't hurt, and allow you to watch your movie in any mode.

If it doesn't work as expected, try the same DVD on your other installation.
Anyway, the method is correct. If it fails, it's because your hardware is not configured properly, is not standard compliant or is really bad.

[photo_angel2004]

I didnt know you had to change the settings on the player I will look into that. Thanks

[masscamp24]

to summarize, you should verify the settings of the player of your kids: it must be configured for a 4:3 TV, and your preferred AR should be pan&scan.
You must also at least tick the automatic p&s flag in Domain Streams Attributes, but theoretically, ticking also the letterbox scan doesn't hurt, and allow you to watch your movie in any mode.

If it doesn't work as expected, try the same DVD on your other installation.
Anyway, the method is correct. If it fails, it's because your hardware is not configured properly, is not standard compliant or is really bad.

I must say that I have been trying to cenvert ws to fs with no success for some time now . However I stumble upon this post and follow the instructions given by rOIZ and it works Thanks you are the best.

[r0lZ]

[idontno]

I may be wrong, but I don't believe I have viewed any WS movie on a friends' WS TV that didn't have the black horizontal bars at the top/bottom.

No, I definantly don't like Pan & Scan, but what's the difference?!? If I lose the top/bottom of the screen, I still feel the same way.

If I could get a WS movie to completely fill a WS TV, I may not have so much resistance to it. And, I'm not alone in feeling this way. A good many of my friends are anti - WS too, for this reason! .

It is a format that I reckon' I will never completely warm up to; I guess watching movies pre-WS, (up until the mid to late 80's or so) everything looked okay; If things were missing from the "sides", & I didn't know it 'cause I could'nt see it missing, I guess it didn't bother me...but I can see the top/bottom portion of the screen missing, & that Does bother me!

Apparently I am not alone in thinking this way on here either, judging from the number of threads devoted to this subject on here & in other forums!

Can't teach old dog new tricks-

YESSSS! Someone finally agrees with me. How many years was FS good enuff? Then they come out with this long skinny ass screen. For what?
M-O-N-E-Y. It's a fad. Unfortunately one that will be here to stay.

How can this...



Be better than this?...



IMO FS is easier on the eyes. WS is like sitting in the first row in a theater. You miss whats happening on one side of the screen because your'e watching the other side of the screen.

That's My Opinion.

.